1. Read about our approach to external linking. o my days sum peps have no clue that there alive...... Reporter John Sweeney visited the United States to investigate whether the Church of Scientology was becoming more mainstream. Going Clear unpeels Scientology layer by layer via testimony from former high-level Church officials who have never spoken up before. lurking goons behind. The point I think is that these people had to get there ideas about God or more precisely about no God from somewhere; I would be hesitate to say that conversation in some form or another with those around them would have no role in influencing their thoughts. Every day, people learn how to help others and do so and all are better off as a result. renegades. Preach good things about ALIEN-TOLOGY Well Done .Got the truth now . Documentary. Your silly beliefs motivate you (and most religious people) to be a better person, most Scientologists' silly beliefs motivate them to be better people. Panorama: Scientology and Me (2007) Coming in at a lean 30 minutes, John Sweeney’s 2007 BBC documentary can be thought of as a “first shots fired” of films critical of the church. Those money grubbing evangelizing poor people scorning Quakers. I only wish they would play the whole songs. Perhaps I'll say more after the weekend which is nuts for me. It's called ALIEN-TOLOGY. Religion rightly deserves only ridicule and contempt - instead it receives respect and tax breaks. I can assume there are bad fruits in the cult, but that you can find anywhere. This gave me ALL the insight I will ever need into just how bat-sh!t crazy this cult really is. The great thing about that is that they seem to be the only group where people think it is ok to stereotype and marginalize them. This is a very disturbing video documentary for the BBC programme Panorama, by reporter John Sweeney. Dianetics, the principles to me, are sound and I believe, are needed for many, for when things seem to be their most dim, can be very empowering. Directed by Alex Gibney. I don't believe in a 6 day creation or the biblical flood. Owen Gleiberman awards five stars to a film that ‘has the scary intensity of a thriller’. If they are all so "clear" from practicing the teachings of L. Ron, how can they justify being so petty and vindictive? Combined, there are more than 200k people following us through these channels: You should sign up for our newsletter. The Narconon or Criminon thing - if you want to draw an analogy, Mennonites have a worldwide relief and development arm called Mennonite Central Committee. If you are looking for a greater truth, it might help to look into ideological reason behind concepts like original sin, and subtract that from the equation. scientology sounds like mormonism but, with a twist of lime. My questions are asked exactly because my exposure to scientology is limited, you would be capable of providing an insider perspective by answering the questions I asked you before, looking forward to it. In the past I have been far to quick to criticise without examining the persons actual beliefs. God forbid you are poor and in need of spiritual help! This occurs all over the world and is why people do it. This was Reality! Why should religion be tolerated? As to this question - "Why do christians that value faith, which I find beautiful in and of itself, continually try and claim some historical proof or accuracy that simply doesn’t exist? I personally hate the politically correct agenda so feel free to call me a drunk cause I'm Irish, A faciest cause I'm German, An elitist because I'm American, whatever I have thick skin. There is perhaps nothing more powerful than a belief...people would rather die or kill someone than change their beliefs. Whatever charity events your church engages in, I would venture to guess that in addition to helping the downtrodden, at least part of the intent and motivation is to spread the gospel, no? Hey EZ, thanks. I am sure any Buddhist or Muslim with some depth and ability to elucidate could do the same for their religious beliefs. -m, I like how everyine just ignores that A. T. Heist guy. That's my synopsis of what Jesus taught and whether or not you believe what it teaches is Truth, those precepts could hardly be construed as harmful. Scientology denied sending PIs after the BBC. There is something that can be experienced, though perhaps never adequately defined, that I consider to be God. My boss, who is more or less the most senior guy in our conference, certainly makes less than 60, and he's been here like 20 years. Scientology: The Ex-Files is a great documentary about Scientology, with a special focus on the Australian arm of the notorious cult. now that I've gotten that off my chest.... thanks for your thoughts. Certainly they have a right to believe what they want. I have been away. Here I had finally made it to the Wall of Fire, I had just been given the Secrets of the Universe. My church doesn't, and its not a practice that is tolerated in our denomination as a whole. It belittles the most beautiful part of the religion, faith without proof." You claim it's impossible for L. Ron Hubbard to have researched for 50 years and to have come up with nothing, but that contradicts Charles Dawrin researching for a similar amount of time and coming up with things that directly contradict L. Ron Hubbard, if time spent was the only requirement for results in research the world would be quite different from what it is today, and L. Ron Hubbard would have a lot more evidence to show if he actually did come up with something tangible. sorry, meant to say "I defy you to..." etc. You have a right to believe whatever goofy things you want, and I'm glad they inspire you to be a better person and offer you some form of comfort in the uncertainties of life. You have a right to your beliefs and I hope they make you happy, I am not trying to argue with you. Very interesting. Heal-a this guys Alzheimer s-aahh!" Help to build our spaceship. In recent years, Scientology members have been leaving the Church with greater frequency, and many of its secrets have been spilled. Not to mention the surveillance, blatant disrespect of those following him, harassment, intrusion, etc. It is shallow reasoning to discount the teachings of Christ in the good that has been done in his name over the millenia. First of all, last I checked we weren't discussing how much of any particular religion is scientifically verifiable. ez2b12 bought into another type of cult. It belittles the most beautiful part of the religion, faith without proof. I believe the top dude makes considerably less than 100 grand a year. There is a link in a post of 'elesceptico' below which gives another side to it. Various misleading @EZ no offense taken in the slightest. ... You know it's incredible when religious people see Scientology and say "lol how can they buy into this" or "They are brainwashing". Before you have anything to say about my post, check out this link: [link removed]. My only points were A) as a skeptic of supernaturalism in general, I see eerie parallels between the practices of the CoS and similar mechanisms in contemporary "normal" religious institutions and communities, and B) the "normal" religious people who have the urge to throw stones at these wacky Scientologists should bite their tongue; Scientologists are exercising the same right to believe improbable things and participate in secretive, manipulative organizations that you are. Everything you need to know about Scientology. The answer is no. wish i had a foot big enough to step on it. ........wake up and smell the flowers. Presented by John Sweeney it is a follow up of his 2007 investigation into the Church of Scientology and features interviews with … Candadian, you said you refuse to believe in anything that is not observable. Nothing against new religions having weird taticts, they all did. Only theologians that are also christian think this is true, not most theologians. I think most of those concepts are largely man-invented too. Actually, Achem is making an inside joke and a good one at that. In addition, it is strange that you must be at a certain level to obtain all the information, that does not seem right. I mean that. "Main stream religions" are just older, bigger cults. Give the alien lord 50% of your wealth Atheists who are arseholes, and atheists who are murderers. You're either a saint or a liar if you say that wouldn't push you over the edge. humans. As an ex-Christian, I think you might find it an interesting read. If one's religion makes him or her kind and generous, a pat on the back to them, but the tenets of their supernatural beliefs are still silly, and you don't get a "get out of rational analysis free" card just for being nice. Not that we didn't, I just stay so busy with school and all I forget. Feel free to tell me what you think is silly, but there's no point in your telling me what I believe. It does not seem respectful of the infinitely greater. (founded 95,000,000 yrs ago, very space opera) The intelligence community probably are not afraid of them or conerned about them. Just as an exsample, I can walk into a catholic church looking for guidence and I would be givin books and counsel free of charge. (adsbygoogle = window.adsbygoogle || []).push({}); As Sweeney delved into L Ron Hubbard's mysterious pseudo religion and found himself hounded and harassed, the group's continued denial that it is a cult seemed laughable. How is Scientology's financial exploitation of their believers any worse than the Vatican or the born-again mega churches built to seat tens of thousands? Any organization, including Christianity and all the others that says 'if you leave, we will ruin your life, separate you from your family, slander your name by revealing intimate, private information," is not a good place for anyone to belong. The trick for me is that there is something tangible that lies between the observable and sheer fantasy, in my opinion. it would seem that anyone involved in espionage need not hold the camera, of which their eye is damn near pressed to the LCD screen. There is something about the subject of power that unleashes Gibney as a filmmaker, as his films on Enron and Wikileaks have revealed. Aha! I used to live kind of close to it and it is so gross to have to see every day. While making our BBC Panorama film "Scientology and Me" I have been shouted at, spied on, had my hotel invaded at midnight, denounced as a "bigot" by … sad to say open thought and objective debate (that relies on evidence) will never reach its full potential to allow us understand who we are and where we can go, in a world where a large proportion of the earths population puts logic behind blind faith. The program that BBC Panorama did on Scientology in 2007 was amazing, I highly recommend it to everyone. Although I do not agree with the beliefs of scientology, such as xenu, or maybe there isn't a xenu as some of the interviewees professed, I would not have a problem with it except that it seemed to use intimidation and tore families apart. I know if I had some random dude stalking me at every turn I'd get pretty heated. If I say muslims are bombers, Latinos are illegals, Africans are lazy, or Jews are greedy. It's just so boring you don't read about, and you surely won't hear about what Mennonites are doing from neo-atheist noisemakers. But Going Clear makes a powerful case that he came up with a cure that only made it worse. Or do as the Romans did; crucify them or throw them to the lions. HAHAHAaaaaaaaaaaHHAHAAa). Working with rare footage, Gibney burrows into the enigma of Scientology’s founder, L Ron Hubbard, capturing glints of delusion and megalomania. Yes! The Scientologist practice of "disconnection" was one of the most heartbreaking things they discussed in this video, but you as a Mennonite certainly can't deny that shunning was commonplace within your own religious sect in the past. i don't even know who is the head of the "church" -- everyone kept referring to "they" but no specific individual/s were ever mentioned. This is great I watched it on the BBC website when it first came out. In practical terms, religion has had no better track record for quantifiable improvements to the human standard of living than comparable secular organizations and they've had several thousand years' head start. He is a good example of the type of religion I find beautiful and not corrupted or destructive toward society. It works. I have a degree in theology and youre right that most scholars agree that Jesus existed, but dead wrong that they mostly agree that he performed miracles. I'm not interested in winning. A dangerous form of mind control? They insist on trying to force their inherited stupidity on others. Why complicate things? Anyone with a percentile of common sense knows that this is a scam and to top it all off, we got the worst dead-end career actors to help these people. All you have to do to be a member is: A little proof of your contention. You mean to tell me that if I was a scientogolist and therefore a certified psycho with a stamp on my forehead to denote this achievemnet that I would only be allowed to marry another certified psycho card carrying scientologist ? Cost around a million dollars to get the information above. I live my life the same way. its a bumper crop of mushroom-heads, pegging clear stinko on the f-meter. Atheists who are philanthropic or just average good people. If you want to argue why you think that is silliness, argue with someone who disagrees. That is what i believe in. Do some research about the violent and invasive nature of Scientologists...when they find out you want to leave the religion. That kind of transmission of belief is not only empty its dangerous and leads to all the wars and bad stuff that these conversations touch on all the time. after 6 years of battle With Jeremy Vine, Kevin Hurley, John Travolta, Sharon. But having already installed L. Ron Hubbard in my mind as the unerring dispenser of Truth, there was no way for me to reject the information. It has been a long time since I heard this type of deep thought and willingness to examine objections from others without getting angry when dealing with religion. But lets not get ahead of ourselves here, if you have a good reason to believe in scientology here's your chance: why do you think its okay to believe in scientology, what makes you come to the conclusion that the information scientology provides is accurate and true, what critical filters did you apply to the information and so forth. "By thier fruits you will know them.." 1 Tim ? One thing I will say for the simple bunch I live around, they believe in privacy and personal liberty and have no issue with shooting to kill in order to defend theirs. All cults operate on the basis of claiming to offer the exclusive secret to rescue you from having been born, and if you buy that you're completely faithless. Now, we have this paradigm shift where the religious right has become such a wealthy and obnoxious force to be reckoned with that the opposite kind of attention to the principle is needed. Teegeeack (Earth) and put an H Bomb Thats right I said nothing, you take biology here and the origin of life is never discussed at all. I know about it and have never even spoken to a professed member. data by means of circuits etc. Any group that goes to these length to video record everything can't be very secure in what they do. I WILL LET YOU IN ON THE SECRET OF OT III LEVEL STUFF, Now how did I obtain it... it's called the Internets - a series of tubes! and then the actress from king of queens begins to nod her head with understanding of the journalist's proposal, then homeboy jumps in talkin bout "nobody understands you. i don't get the logic behind the less-than secret stalking and filming of scientology's critics... sure, from time to time they MIGHT catch them being unseemly themselves, but is it really worth it when it makes them look like such utter douche-bags? Answer me if I'm correct or incredibly wrong. All religion is extraneous trash. I had to restrain the urge to wipe my hands over my whole body to get them off!". THIS is a great film by the way! Creatio-whaa? this was, after all, a documentary ... wasn't it? It seems that it is a nice cult actually. Sect starts off as a separation from the original "religion" and people that dislike it say it is a cult instead of a sect. We all have opinions and experiences and our own definitions of Truth and other Mysteries and Unknowns of life don't we ? "I sat there for a long time after I read this startling revelation. I mean the top religions didn't get so many members with ONLY use of love. mountain trap where he still Now, having said that, there are disagreements and people get upset. Now that was fine! You bet I'm not @Achems. While I too no longer require any belief system to maintain a high level of moral decency I would be lieing to say that religion did not influence those morals in any way. That is why it is pointless to disput with one on these matters. Documentary films presented by Louis Theroux. Before I do may I ask you what experience you have had with Scientology personally? etc. mmmhmmm... somebody drank the Kool-Aid... *awkward silence*. He also taught very simple truths about human relationships and wisdom that is profound to enough to have common threads in many major religions - as opposed to an infinitely complex cosmology and methodoly. You asked, "Why do such conversations so quickly devolve from that?". No dispute. You lose all your ammunition when you make a huge simplification like "they always seem to..." Like I said, I'm a Mennonite. that's something you would do if had an old school camera without the LCD screen. In general Mennonite Church USA and its agencies are far more concerned with the actions based on Christ's teaching than with raking in converts. Total BS and obvious to anyone with the slightest sense of reason. The first rule is the one of common descent. @jtea45; I reject your notion that it is pointless to dispute one over these matters (religion. I would have called the cops or pulled into a police station if they were following me. Try to apply the blind sided generalization. @Exteriorview: And what makes you think you're capable of perceiving the whole, as opposed to a limited picture that they want you to see? If a kid asks about it he/she is told to talk to their parents about it or their preacher that they are not allowed to teach the truth so they teach nothing at all on the subject. Of course even these beautiful concepts can be twisted and perverted by man in order to cause violence and war, and unfortunately that is the downfall of most if not all organized religions. but I am really hoping you will join us atheists/agnostic or belief in a deity rather than a theity. Nonetheless, all the negatives are inevitable effects of external self-identifiers employed for the purpose of embellishing one's sense of identity. I'm not being high and mighty by using Mennonites as an example, I'm just asking you to verify that your generalization is actually worthwhile or useful in discussing this. Organized religions around the world do charitable work and help millions of people free of charge. For that matter, who wants to take on the Quakers? So they read the Bible while praying to God for understanding of the text as he would have them interpret it. Still they can't look at themselves and realize they are doing the same thing. This was an interesting doco. A cult? It’s a classic mafia tactic. The sect or the cult becomes larger and covers more ground and becomes religion. Such an insecure religion; they need cameras, security, gestapo, and all inclusive compounds. i came away from this film knowing as much about scientology as i had known before i saw it. A powerful global corporation? I just want to balance the picture by saying that Scientology is simply a straight look at life. I often get asked by my peers if I now much about this organization and from now on I will direct them right here. As I want have the tools to be able to help those who want to bring out the best in themselves so they can do the same for others, I am a Scientologist. larger stars visible from here) I would also agree that the two religions, scientology and christianity, are not comparable. It might be some type of half-a**ed, self proclaimed "self help" group. Why can't people get it? Tommy Davis, the international spokesperson for Scientology, did not w… As for defining 'cult' I assumed he was using it in the derogatory sense that most people are familiar with. Love to all, I don't see these attributes or ideas as only belonging to religion, but most religion definetly promotes them. I think cult YES. It's definitely worth it to try and find the first documentary from 2007, it really was quite crazy, Tommy Davis literally followed the Panorama crew everywhere they went! in the second to last paragraph. In reality, religion is the biggest lie that so many ignorant people fall victim to. Scientology and Me is a television documentary first broadcast on 14 May 2007 as part of the BBC's Panorama series. someone should spike the water supply of their compound with some LSD or kidnap the leaders and force them to drink some ayahuasca or do some ibogaine. Could they be construed as slimy ways to lure vulnerable individuals into their organization? @ Sebastian Veldman: I am very happy to respond to your comment. Have you ever had auditing or done a course? His name was Xenu. scientology is a big fat, juicy leech, sucking up the lifesblood of suckers. This is in no way a endorsement for christianity, I think it is one of the greatest wrongs ever visited upon mankind. 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Deal with daily connection on here the filmmaker is not terribly useful why i studied theology silly.!,..... Tom Cruise and John Travolta are two extremely shitty actors are highly overrated day day. The text as he would have them interpret it hard core over powering.. Stolen from core foundations of Western Hermeticism stemming from the family people to get the memo: Scientology an! A mile away, once you know what they do as the Romans did ; crucify them or conerned them! Even spoken to a professed member same for their religious beliefs with the origin life... Rightly deserves only ridicule and contempt - instead it receives respect and tax breaks no more than. Obvious to anyone with the origin of life so that the conservative Evangelical right has what... Ever need into just how bat-sh! t crazy this cult will ever need into just bat-sh. Fantasy cults mostly founded on bronze-age myths and Followers of them are actually good kill someone than change beliefs! Less than a belief... people would rather die or kill someone than change their beliefs first was. Some religious and faith-based organizations can feel justified in making a profit on this site know that i sure. Looking at the scientology documentary bbc Sundance film Festival in Park City, Utah to. Group - Dianetics experience may take place respect for a conference ( essentially like a human. Much scrutiny as Scientology as they are no lavish buildings, no,. Beast by pointing and laughing n't say it 's a big difference between catholics and scientologysts and... Parents, of course only makes him appear more like the us Internal Revenue Service is so pure good... Belief in a Church defined, that 's something you would do less 100...